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Rockstar from another dimension | Is my realtor full of bs about washington state real estate? |
I'm trying to buy my first house, in the cheaper suburbs about 30 miles outside off seattle. I've been trying to buy for 8 years but prices were always one step ahead of me. This is the first time I've been able to find a house that meets my criteria I'm looking for, within my comfortable budget ($220K). However heres the thing, I'm a stable guy who hates moving. I want to live in the house for 15 years to life, so I'm not concerned about equity, just concerned about getting a good house.
Right now, although I have seen a couple houses that meet my criteria in that price range, they are few and far between, and are major fixer uppers. I feel like if prices fell 20-50K, I'd have many more options, and that I could actually find a real nice house within my price/criteria to live in for a long time, rather that one that will "be good enough, but less than ideal.
Now my realtor says that prices are going to go up in 2009. Worrying me that if I don't buy a less than ideal fixer upper real soon, that I might not be able to find one again within my comfortable budget.
I've really been paying attention to the economy lately, and been studying all sorts of different financial sources recenly, and all the hard data indicates the opposite. More and more major layoffs, including boeing and other major corporations, auto industry possibly failing, forclosures still on the rise with record numbers expected between now and 2010, and house prices still on the decline according to case schiler, ofheo, s&p, and every other source I could find.
It seems like historically house prices roughly followed the inflation rate, until the housing bubble which shot them sky high. Then it burst and and they have only just started the decline around 2006-2007, and still have a very long ways to get back down closer to the inflation rate they have typically followed. And if real estate normally works in 7 year cycles, it seems like we might have 5 more years of decline to go.
Now I know Obama will try hard to fix things, but even he admits it will take time (if it works at all).
I told this to my realtor, and asked him how he gets his predictions that house prices will go up in 2009, when all the data I can find shows the opposite. He just told me that I'm looking at broad data of all the us, and that the washington state economy is on of the strongest and will be the soonest to bounce back. He says its already showing signs of coming back.
So is this a bunch of bs and I will most likely be safe waiting for prices to drop a little more, to find a more ideal house. Or is he likely telling the truth?
PS: Remember, I'm not really looking for an investment house, but rather a long term house to live in that hopefully is nice, rather than run down. Even though I could settle on a run down house if it was all I could afford. I'd be kicking myself if I bought a run down house, and then a year later saw the market flooded with more plentiful choices of nicer homes for the same price. |
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Landlord
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He has no idea if they are going to go up or down.
My feeling is either stable or down for another 2 years. I do not see them increasing next year.
But, I am just guessing to. But, I think that most people involved with real estate or investing do not see a rise in the near future, your agent is one of very few.
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StockTrdr
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you are correct and you have a desperate realtor to get a sale done. Fire him and find a much more realistic one who will work with you to find a house that you can lowball and get at a realistic price. Try the 15 times annual rent method with the house you like. If the house is priced higher then 15 times annual rent in a comparable size/type then the current home owner is aiming too high.
Good for you researching for yourself!!! |
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Leo F
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No sure where your RE agent is coming up with the idea that homes will have price increases in 2009, but as of today I have not found a market that is not still not declining. I do market research every day in, King, Thurston, kitsap and Pierce county and they all are still declining. The gov still has to put a floor under the foreclosure market and that will run into 2010. It sound like your agent is trying to scare you into buying now so he or she can make a sale. If your looking for a bigger bang for your buck check out south pierce county. You still can buy a nice home in a nice neighborhood between $250-$200K and remember you agent only makes money when you buy so don't take a lot of what they say as truth. I would not buy yet as NO one knows where this market is going. |
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Ed Atun
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Part of being successful in sales is to get people motivated to act now; not tomorrow or next year. So salespeople sometimes say things that can not be proven to be true. But , often, home buyers say "Thanks for getting me to act." That may be true in your case. Of course prices are headed down next year. Maybe by a huge margin. That doesn't mean you won't be happy with the house you buy today.. |
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IAAW
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The same thing happened to me. I was planning to buy a house and contacted a realtor. She showed me some homes that were in bad shape. After I paid more attention to the economy and real estate market in general, I came to the conclusion that home prices are going to go a whole lot lower throughout 2009. I was watching Suzie Orman Show and she said that the real estate market will go down during all of 2009.
The realtor that I contacted kept pressuring me to buy a house now and don't wait for another moment.
I am not going to listen to her. Obviously, she only cares about her pocket. |
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Rainier
 |
I'm an economist, who is also looking to buy in the Seattle area. Realtors have a pretty bad track record when it comes to predicting the Seattle market. They are out of touch with the current reality as well. Housing prices in Seattle have usually ranged about 3.5x income. That changed in 2001, and especially in the last few years got out of hand, nearing 5-10x annual income depending on the area. That's a bubble, and until prices come back to reasonable levels that people can afford, housing is a bad, bad investment.
I wouldn't even consider buying for another year. The one caveat is that if you can find a nice house and can convince the owner to depart with it for a DEEP discount (say, 25 percent off the current price) you might consider it.
By the way, your realtor is on drugs if they see signs that the market is coming back. There is absolutely NO data to back that up.
Also, prices will probably flatten out for a while at some point. They aren't going to magically spike up. You'll be okay if you wait to see if prices have stopped dropping. |
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I Buy And Sell Houses
 |
I'm a Realtor, so I'm constrained by what I can say, especially since you're already working with a Realtor. However, a few quick observations:
From what I understand, your area of Washington State has fared better than many other areas, and will probably show comparative strength compared to other areas. However, having said that, no one--your Realtor, me, or Alan Greenspan--can predict housing prices next year. So anyone--anyone--who absolutely "knows" what'll happen to housing prices next year is wrong. Period. I personally expect housing prices to continue to fall. I could be wrong, and I'll admit it. Your Realtor could be absolutely correct, but at best he's guessing. (And, no criticism of other Realtors, but through this downward plunge in the market I've kept hearing "This is just a correction" and "This is short-term" and "Things will be better in 3-6 months." There's a level of optimism that, to date, hasn't been borne out by reality.)
There's a bit of a contradiction in what you've said above. On the one hand, you said: "I want to live in the house for 15 years to life, so I'm not concerned about equity, just concerned about getting a good house." On the other, you said, "I'd be kicking myself if I bought a run down house, and then a year later saw the market flooded with more plentiful choices of nicer homes for the same price." I understand both sentiments. However, if you want to live in the house for 15 years or longer, then don't worry about short-term price fluctuations. In 15 years, you'll be way ahead on your investment, whether you buy today or a year from now. So, you don't have to rush into purchases; there will still be good values a year from now. On the other hand, if you see the right property today, then make an offer. With a 15+ year time horizon, it doesn't matter whether you buy in 2008 or 2009.
Also, reexamine what you're looking for in a Realtor. You may be dealing with a really great one, but it may not be the best fit for you. Also, you write: "I've been trying to buy for 8 years but prices were always one step ahead of me. This is the first time I've been able to find a house that meets my criteria I'm looking for, within my comfortable budget ($220K)." It's certainly been possible to find properties in the past 8 years that were affordable for you. Wind back the clock to 2000, pre-bubble. Lots of good values were available back then. Up until about 2003, things were pretty affordable. And even after that point, there were a whole variety of safe ways you could have bought affordably--lease-purchase, lease-option, contract for deed, and so on. You need to work with an agent--perhaps even your current one--who understands what you're looking for.
But you have to be clear and direct with your agent. And if you sense some incompatibility, then you have to reevaluate whether your current agent will best serve your interests.
Hope that helps. |
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godged
 |
I have a friend that lives in Tacoma, so I get up that way from time to time. The Seattle area hasn't taken the pounding that some markets have, doesn't have the long days on market and excessive inventory that other areas are suffering through.
Whether prices go up or down is a coin flip and a prediction. But there are plenty of opinions if you want to look around.
One other factor to consider that you aren't mentioning is interest rates. Since the majority of what you are going to repay is interest, you are going to want to take this into consideration. While you wait for that elusive bottom of the market, it is likely that interest rates will go up after the first of the year.
In case you didn't notice, the government isn't allowing the various troubled institutions to fail. They are prepared to shore up areas that are tanking. The auto industry or the airlines are not going to fail, the trickle down is too significant for the government to allow this to happen. While your doing your research, did you notice that sales volume of homes has been increasing? There is a reason for this, and people are out there buying.
Sounds like you are not comfortable with your Realtor, so don't waste time dealing with him, go find a Realtor that you can work with. |
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Jay S
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I would tend to agree with your realtor. Real estate is unique in the fact that it is very localized. What's happening in the broader market is not indicative of every market. If I remember correctly Washington did not see the same huge appreciation run up that we saw in markets like AZ,CA,NV,FL or the over building. |
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Real Estate Guy
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based just on what you said, I agree with the realtor. You are looking at the whole picture. However, real estate is location, location, location. Like in the DC metro area. We are doing much better then the national avg because we have the US gvpt as one of the major employers.
For 8 years you have been looking. And 5 of the 8 you say prices increase - alot. I bet you believed that prices were to much then and didn't buy. Had you purchased 8 years ago, you would have been ahead of the curve.
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